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Several times I've experienced my icon pulling hard right when taking off on water. Initially I would think weathervaning and as speed increased rudder would become more effective and correct, but as speed increased pull got worse to point after 45 degrees I would reject t/o. I would taxi straight at idle for awhile then with no problem holding heading, but as t/o began , it would pull right again. whether it's engine torgue or weather vaning , I would think by 30 degrees of turn rudder would be effective enough to counter, but it doesn't . In both cases, I ended up taking off downwind with no issues (10 kt wind) the wind was coming from area with obstacles i could not take of towards and so initial takeoffs were with a right xwind. anyone else experience this or understand what happened here?

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Hi Ed,

I have no idea on the cause of your problem. What I do know is that I wouldn’t be taking off or landing until you find the reason. I have many hours in floatplanes, and would not take any chances until you find the smoking gun. That could very well be an accident waiting to happen. Not sure if it’s a problem with the plane, or perhaps your technique. Maybe chat with an Icon instructor, or Icon directly. They may have more insight than someone on this site. Just thought I’d mention it.

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Hi Ed, you were having problem with your nose gear doors not working properly, right? Could they be causing the issue like one staying open ?

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Hi Ed, you were having problem with your nose gear doors not working properly, right? Could they be causing the issue like one staying open ?

Sounds like a good possibility.

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I really don't think the doors are staying open. I'm having a hard time figuring out a scenario where the door stays open due to the way its closed/mechanized. If this was the case it would likely blow the NLG fuse. Besides the nose doors are basically out of the water once full power comes up and are on centerline. A long time ago there was a case where the water rudder shaft bond broke away from the water rudder causing it to not fair correctly but this was a quality escape that was quickly corrected.

The aircraft has quite a large tail that wants to weather vane in cross winds its really important to use proper wind correction controls. This is my bet. The rudder won't be that effective at slow speeds certainly would have difficulty countering a cross wind. Many folks discount the effectiveness of proper aileron and elevator placement. On tail wheel and sea planes placing the stick in the proper location can make a gigantic difference. If I'm ever fighting a plane like you describe I always re-evaluate my cross wind correction. It 100% of the time stops fighting when I do. I watched many miliary flight instructors that came over to ICON as full time instructors struggle with turning or taxiing the through the wind line in 10-15 kt or higher conditions on the water. They would try to put the water rudder down and plow taxi hard to and struggle to get the aircraft through the wind line. I would show them proper control placement and turn the aircraft easily without plowing or using water rudder. They would always be amazed "how did you do that?". The difference is many of them had never flown tailwheels or sea planes and never had to discover the importance of control placement. F-18's, F-16's, T-38's, T-6's and T45's are not a good basis for sea plane or tail wheel flying you barely have to use your feet in those planes nor worry much about control placement at low speed or while taxiing.

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Hey Bret, I tend to agree , it is probably weathervaning, but was able to hold heading at idle power, then as a sped up for t/o it would weathervane beyond what rudder could counter, but I continued- thinking that as speed increased rudder would become more effective (expecting to lose 20-30 degrees of heading and then could correct back to original heading once rudder was more effective, but it would just get worse and after 45 degrees , i would reject. on a later day I went out to larger lake to experiment with xwind t/os and could not duplicate it. so where would an article be on the proper control placement be that you mention, maybe I'm missing some other technique. I do see in volume 3 of icon manuals that xwind t/o should start into the wind and then turn xwind . I'm wondering if hull design is such that if I start xwind (as i did) that the hull is un-even( or one side sticks more) in the water and causes drag on upwind side causing the pull to the right as i accelerated?

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Based on your recent comment, I’m now nearly certain it was just a technique thing. It has to do with how much hull is in the water and how wind is affecting not just your directional control but also your roll angle. This is all correctable with proper control placement. Icon’s manuals are pretty good but the book below is excellent and was on the shelf at icon training centers as they referenced it while making the training manuals. What’s better is competent instruction from a very experienced sea plane CFI. There are many out there. Personally I recommend Terry Hayes in Northern California. She has in the past been affiliated with ICON as a IAFI but not sure her status now she is a highly sought after sea plane instructor and DPE. She was my sea plane instructor 8 years ago. I was able to catch on to these concepts easily as I have more than 3/4 of my total time in tailwheels before sea planes such as Pitts Specials, Super Decathlons, and Cubs. These are critical techniques to avoid ground loops. Terry was in a few high density altitude mountain lake video with Rich Bookbinder (also an excellent instructor).